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Can everything be proved?

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Isn't it so that whatever we *think* of ultimate truth - is not it?

I never refered to ultimate truth. Is the knowledge if one person is a Buddha ultimate truth? I think that ultimate truth refers only to emptiness.

My point was that our way of logic may not be "the way out".

 

Even if there existed such an algoritm, of what use would it be?
I think that in this degenerate age, when there are a lots of self proclaimed false teachers, this would be of some use, no?

But isn't this whole idea a mere fiction? I am trying to be practical, what we can do, not what would be useful if... Knowing that somebody is a Buddha or not, how does that help your practice, your meditation, for example? And isn't it clear that certain individuals are authentic Teachers (that they touch people's hearts and minds with great Compassion and profound Wisdom) and others are not?

 

Regards

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My point was that our way of logic may not be "the way out".

Maybe our way of logic really isn't the way out. I don't know. :? But for me personally, I have the feeling that it helps. Now if it really helps me or not, this I don't know.

 

Knowing that somebody is a Buddha or not, how does that help your practice, your meditation, for example?

I can get some little devotion easier if I think that someone is a Buddha than if I don't.

 

And isn't it clear that certain individuals are authentic Teachers (that they touch people's hearts and minds with great Compassion and profound Wisdom) and others are not?

Why then many people follow wrong teachers, if this is so evident?

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Was this the second pizza?
No, because I think that you didn't give me satisfying arguments yet (however, it's true that it's a bit hard to give me satisfying arguments :wink: ).

Ach, where did I get this karma? :roll:

 

Ok, I see that you like math and I read that you know programming, so I ask you to do this: Write here an algorithm which tells for any being if he has achieved a state of Buddhahood or not.)

Interesting task :D

- define constant: "Buddha-mind" (constant of the type "mind")

- define variables: "tested-mind", "testing-mind" (both of the type "mind")

- read "Buddha mind"

- read "testing-mind"

- compare "testing-mind" with "Buddha-mind"

* if "testing-mind" = "Buddha-mind";

* then read "tested mind";

* compare "tested-mind" with "Buddha-mind";

>> if "tested-mind" = "Buddha-mind";

>> report "Tested being = Buddha";

>> else report "Not Buddha";

* else - report "Error 1 - Only Buddha can recognise Buddha" . 8)

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I can get some little devotion easier if I think that someone is a Buddha than if I don't.

Saying this, don't you fall in belief that Buddha is Buddha from his own side, self existing Buddha?

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Why then many people follow wrong teachers, if this is so evident?

When your karma is ripe, you find the right Teacher. Lama Yeshe's words (paraphrased).

 

Regards

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read "testing-mind"

How does computer do this? What sensors/perceptors does it use to actually perform the operation "read"? Because it must be different to read a being's mind from reading bytes from hard disk. Also, what would be the output of 'write("testing-mind")'.

 

Just a side non-buddhist question: what kind of programming language is it that you used? is it pseudo code or actual programming language? It has no matter in whole discussion, I'm just curious, because I don't remember to have seen it before. :)

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Saying this, don't you fall in belief that Buddha is Buddha from his own side, self existing Buddha?

Nice point :D and maybe you're right, but I think there's no difference (as far as falling in belief of self existence of that being is concerned) if you establish that someone is a Buddha by faith or if you establish that someone is a Buddha by that algorithm.

And we probably agree, that to establish that someone is a Buddha by faith doesn't necessarily mean that you think of him as self existant, right?

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no difference (as far as falling in belief of self existence of that being is concerned) if you establish that someone is a Buddha by faith or if you establish that someone is a Buddha by that algorithm.

I agree. No difference – just various manifestations of ignorance.

to establish that someone is a Buddha by faith doesn't necessarily mean that you think of him as self existant, right?

Absolutely agree. That’s why I’m asking, do you mean that there is no Buddha from his own side when you think that someone is Buddha?

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That’s why I’m asking, do you mean that there is no Buddha from his own side when you think that someone is Buddha?

Yes, I don't think there is a self existant Buddha.

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read "testing-mind"

How does computer do this? What sensors/perceptors does it use to actually perform the operation "read"? Because it must be different to read a being's mind from reading bytes from hard disk. Also, what would be the output of 'write("testing-mind")'.

Hum, what about that pizza? Else, no fuel to move the fingers on the keyboard. :twisted:

 

Just a side non-buddhist question: what kind of programming language is it that you used?

You asked me to write an algorythm, if I remember correctly. So, I listed the succession of steps, in no specific language (but I thought it was English :wink: )

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Hum, what about that pizza? Else, no fuel to move the fingers on the keyboard. :twisted:
Yes, I think I'd like one too, especially after discussing on forum half day on Mahayana precepts day 8)

 

You asked me to write an algorythm, if I remember correctly. So, I listed the succession of steps, in no specific language (but I thought it was English :wink: )
Algorythm is understandable, I was just curious which exotic progamming language did you use. :wink:

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I don't think there is a self existant Buddha

So, what is the difference between two approaches:

First one is when we believe that someone is Buddha from his own side and second one, when we believe that someone is Buddha which doesn’t exist from his own side? What will happen with our faith in Buddha in both cases? Will the faith keep the same or will differ somehow in both cases? 8O

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So, what is the difference between two approaches:

First one is when we believe that someone is Buddha from his own side and second one, when we believe that someone is Buddha which doesn’t exist from his own side? What will happen with our faith in Buddha in both cases? Will the faith keep the same or will differ somehow in both cases? 8O

I don't think there's much difference in faith.

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