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About beginning of the mind, consciousness and karma

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Could we say then, that the consciousness is a reflection of the ignorant mind, and the lung (vital energy) is a reflection of the non-ignorant mind?

 

Best regards,

Simona

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Tashi Delek Simona,

 

Personally I do not think we can really talk about the reflection of the non-ignorant mind, as when the mind has overcome its ignorance, it has become enlightened and thus does not reflect anything anymore...

 

My kindest regards,

Frederic

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Tashi Delek, Frederic.

 

You want to say that non-ignorant mind is a vital energy itself. Now, about the relationship between energy and mind there is an interesting text of His Holiness the Dalai Lama:

 

Research into the exact nature of the relation between the brain, consciousness, and energy proves to be very interesting. When all the functions of the brain have stopped and physiological conditions have disappeared, it would seem that a form of the process of consciousness continues to exist. This has been observed in the experience of certain realized lamas whose bodies, although declared clinically dead, do not decompose and remain fresh for several days or even several weeks. At this stage, the Buddhist point of view maintains that the individual is not altogether dead, that he is continuing to evolve through the process of death, and that he remains in a state of subtle consciousness. I think scientists ought to seek logical explanations for these cases when the body does not decompose even when the functions of the brain and the body have stopped.

 

The texts also give accounts of meditators who have learned to develop a supernatural ability to create physical objects with their mind, or produce elements such as fire and air, perceived not only by their creator but also, apparently, by other people. Other types of mentally created objects are only perceived by the meditator. I do wonder what the substantial, material cause of these external objects might be. If there is a result -- a mentally created physical object -- it must be preceded by a cause and conditions of the same nature. I also wonder if these objects exist solely during the practitioner's meditation, and cease to exist as soon as he leaves his meditative absorption. I cannot say what the material cause of this type of mentally created object might be. It is a question I address to the monastic community: can consciousness become a substantial cause of material objects? The Tantras, such as that of Guhyasamaja, speak of the illusory body and its substantial cause, which is purported to be subtle energy, as subtle energy is part of the material world. I must say that this problem leaves me puzzled.”

 

Source: http://hhdl.dharmakara.net/hhdlquotes3.html

 

Best regards,

Simona

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You want to say that non-ignorant mind is a vital energy itself.

 

Actually, that is not what I want to say... I do not know what non-ignorant ("enlightened") mind really is, actually I don't even think it can be qualified with words... I would rather think that what lies beyond ignorance can never be expressed with words, which may put us in the right direction, but in the end, wordly explanations for which has transcended wordly phenomenom can never give us a true taste of "genuine" realization...

 

All the best,

Frédéric

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Tashi Delek, Frederic.

 

I do not understand one thing. More subtle the mind is, more non-ignorant is. More grosser it is, more ignorant is. And it is said that everything starts with the most subtle level of the mind, that the gross levels and not so subtle levels of the mind are the revelation of the subtle level of the mind. How is possible that something, which is light and pure, reveals itself as darkness and unpurity? Or, it just seems to us that it is so? What, if everything is ok just as it is? How to accept this? What, if the war going on out there, it is in the fact me, some child crying out there, it is me,... If everything is in me, then I really do not see a problem to accept that, cause it is alredy within “myself” (whatever does it mean).

 

Best regards,

Simona

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How is possible that something, which is light and pure, reveals itself as darkness and unpurity?

 

Because the pureness and the light are hidden by clouds and clouds of ignorance, that fools a sentient being into believing that he or she exists independently from all the other phenomenom and beings that he or she perceives... Most of the bigger problems of humanity come from what? They come from selfishness, wouldn't you say? Selfishness and grasping! Why are people selfish? Because they believe to truly exist (ego...) and thus to be more important than all other beings... Hence selfishness, hence grasping, hence problems... If people were less selfish and gave more importance to other beings, things would be better off, don't you think? But we are more concerned about sending rockets on the moon or becoming rich and powerful than by feeding and healing poor, sick and starving people of this planet... The great majority of us haven't understood a thing yet, and probability is, that we will go on like that until we destroy ourselves... We human beings reveal to be somewhat dark and dangerous, because we are and have been ignorant forever, because we have not understood the real nature, the fondamental nature, of why it is we "exist" and why it is we suffer! We "exist" and suffer because we are ignorant... But we do nothing to cure this ignorance! We want to be truly happy, but we constantly turn our back from true happiness by looking for it in wordly matters and pleasures, which are complete illusions and which in the end, bring more and more suffering upon us... No matter what we do, we are always unsatisfied!! And we just don't know why, so we continue to look for the moon where it is not... We are caught in a samsaric web, from which it is indeed difficult to pull out!

 

I don't believe practicing Buddhism means not accepting outer or inner phenomena, rather, helping you accept them as they truly are, empty, impermanent illusions. The true nature of the mind forever remains unaffected by its ignorance, no matter how deep and dark it gets! A child may cry because he is suffering, and although you and him are ultimately one and the same, it doesn't make his suffering go away, unfortunately... You see, we are caught in this relative, painful "reality"... But you better talk to Lama Shenphen about that, a Bodhisattva will give you much better answers than I ever can on this matter...

 

Thank you and all the best,

Frédéric

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Tashi Delek, Frederic.

 

Thank you very much for all your thoughts (I read some of them again and again)

and your patience with my questions. :wink:

 

All the best,

Simona

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